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Old 13 October 2006, 00:03   #1
shrewiside
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Default wagon upgrade advice please?

heloo everyone, i have a gf8c58d import wagon, 1995, and want to do some staged mods but need advice.
i'm told a tdo5 is a good place to start, but some say i'll need a remap or z4 ecu, others say i won't need to swap ecu or map and that mine will cope with a turbo upgrade, decat pipe and improved air flow.
any chance of some definitive answers please, do i need to use a z4 with a turbo upgrade, and does the turbo upgrade have to be an angled entry as my tdo4 is or can a straight entry tdo5 be used with modded piping?
thanks already, cheers, shrew
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Old 13 October 2006, 00:24   #2
SNAP-ON
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Default UPGRADE

you can only use a z4 with a tdo5 dont use on a tdo4 as they cant handle it apparently , i have a 94 uk wagon which come standard with tdo5 (more lag) i fitted a z4 , hks induction kit , tsl center decat , tsl group n back box and an arc dump valve much better then standard now , i would go with fitting a td05 and a z4 first but up to you
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Old 13 October 2006, 00:36   #3
Heple
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Forget the Z4 and get an Apexi Power FC and get it mapped properly if you fitting a TD05 (Which is a very good turbo for your needs), that is the only way to unleash its real power.

You would also need a 2.5" full decat exhaust and panel filter, but it wont brake 300bhp

To brake 300bhp your gonna need :

- Fuel Pump (walbro)
- Fuel Regualor (SX)
- Parrallel Fuel Mod
- Upgraded Headers/Manifold (Harvey Ported Headers)
- Front Mount Intercooler
- Induction Kit (K&N)
- 440cc Injectors

Hope this helps

Craig
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Old 13 October 2006, 08:54   #4
shrewiside
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thanks guys, and yes they both help, but not definitively as they conflict again, one says yep do tdo5 and z4 the other says no do the "i'm made of money route!"

only joking, i would love to get close to the 300bhp area, i reckon for a wagon it'd be a hoot yet still reliable and user friendly, i.e i won't need 500 clutches every time i leave some lights!

but there is a huge difference in budget if we're talking the apexi route, and so many folk have said that a z4 ecu would suffice, what does a guy do, save 700 quid and put that towards some 18" rims perhaps?????

i dont know what to do, the other thing is i've so many folk say that following a remap they felt the car drove no differently whatsover, and what really annoys me is that so few of the remap guys and apexi sellers, don't even have a suitable rolling road.

this may not be as big a problem as i think, but coming from a sportsbike background, where the equivalent equipment would be a power commander, you cannot do any better than load a very basic safe running map without measuring exactly whats happening at what revs, UNDER REAL LOAD, and that means a four wheel drive rolling road with re-created forced air surely. without this i fail to see how any mapper, no matter how genius can tailor a fuel/air/ignition map to suit a car running different components and engine charcteristics to the last one, whilst its sat idling in his workshop...

impossible i reckon, now, wheres my chequebook!!!

cheers, guy's

shrew
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Old 13 October 2006, 10:40   #5
Heple
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The Z4 will be suffice with just a TD05, decat and panal filter but it will only get around 280bhp max.

A mappable ECU will get much more (but as you say this when your pockets get lighter)

ALSO

Mapping does make alot of difference and most mappers dont need a rolling road they live map on the roads.

Speak to the likes of:

Andy F
Bob Rawle
Jolly Green Monster
Andrew C
Zen Performance

There all on Here - Somewhere

They will give you some very good advice.

Craig
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Old 13 October 2006, 10:45   #6
borat52
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Before you spend any money take a serious look at ESL chips and scoobyecu chips.

I have a 1993 WRX wagon with a TD05. When I got it, engine was completely standard with a TD04 running 0.75 bar of boost. Was nippy but not 'fast'. My turbo started macking an awfull noise 1 year after I bought it so I changed it to a TD05 with an ESL chip. This transformed the car as it now pushes 1.1 bar of boost and makes about 280BHP (It came de-catted). Now its certainly a lot faster.

However there is a noticable lag with the TD05 over the TD04, and ESL also do chips for the TD04 which raise boost to 1.0 bar and pump out about 270BHP. They cost about 195 I think (check ebay as they are always on there) and you just solder them into your existing ECU (easy job).

It really is the cheapest way of gettting another 40BHP. Personally I'd start with one of these then think about spending >1.5K on getting an extra 20BHP when you have just gained 40 for 195.

If I was making the choice again I'd go TD04 with an ESL chip ahead of my TD05 any day of the week, as the TD04 is very responsive.
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Old 14 October 2006, 11:38   #7
shrewiside
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hmmm, sounds interesting, thanks for that borat.

i must admit i do like the response and lack of lag the td04 has, but i just find it runs out of boost too quick, compared to my legacy gt which just gets better and better the more you rev it, 5500 plus is just such a sweet spot!

i know the gt is two stage twin turbo but i can't help thinking that a bigger turbo, longer lasting boost, will make the wagon a lot more fun, and i just hate being underpowered compared to a saloon of all things!!!!

thanks again, i'll look into the esl chip thing, and reccomendations for dealers?

cheers, shrew
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Old 23 October 2006, 19:46   #8
borat52
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I'm glad you responded to this thread because I've got power hungry again too!
Currently running standard WRX 1993 except:
full decat
ESL chip
panel filter

This is making about 280BHP with 1.1 bar of boost. (This would be as far as you could go in terms of power out of a TD04)

However I have just spoken to andy from ESL and he has a map for TD05 cars which he can supply for the folowing mods:
440cc injectors
FMIC
induction kit
boost controller

This chip is mapped to 1.4 bar boost and is reported to give 320+ BHP with the above mods. I'm personally going to get all of this stuff together over the next few weeks and build it up by the end of november, install a knock link and slowly build up from the 1.1 bar of boost I'm running at the moment.

I think the above can be bought for around 500 if you shop around for some deals, and all of the work can be done by yourself given a bit of time and a willingness to learn. Pretty nice project to break 300BHP if you ask me.

Also what is a parallel fuel mod?
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Old 23 October 2006, 21:51   #9
Heple
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Quote:
Originally Posted by borat52
Also what is a parallel fuel mod?
This is a modification to the fuel rail that prevents number 3 cylinder from leaning out.

e.g

Diagram 1 standard fuel system

Click the image to open in full size.

Diagram 2 fuel rail mod

Click the image to open in full size.

Here's a link for intructions to performing the mod

NorthUrsalia.com: Series To Parallel Fuel Delivery

Craig
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Old 23 October 2006, 21:57   #10
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my wagon makes 272bhp and maximum boost of 1.2bar on the standard turbo with a few extra bits......this must be about on the limit then ?
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Old 23 October 2006, 22:09   #11
deanwoodward
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this is just what i was looking for got me a shopping list
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Old 24 October 2006, 09:58   #12
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Shrewiside, I'm a step behind Borat52, I've got a full 2.5" decat, K&N panel filter, running a TD04 with a ESL chip it shifts compared to the standard version.
Within the next 2 weeks I'll have fitted a TD05 running with the appropriate ESL chips, can't wait.

Don't forget about the brakes and suspension to cope with the extra power and enable you to go quicker around the twisties.

Althrough saying that I haven't bothered.....yet
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Old 24 October 2006, 09:58
 
 
 
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