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Old 02 December 2007, 17:39   #1
Deep Singh
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Default Legality of barbed wire?

Is there any reason why I can't put barbed wire on the top of my side entrance and roof edges of my garage? the house (and garage etc) is set back at least 15 foot from the pavement (if that makes any difference)

Thanks

ps I know it looks horrid but want to secure my house as much as possible
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Old 02 December 2007, 17:41   #2
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Law says No Im afraid.... all to do with people hurting themselves as they break into your property.

You could put anti-bandit paint on as once it is on you cant wash it off and the police can arrest you for questioning if they see people with it on.
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Old 02 December 2007, 17:46   #3
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A quick google search brings up this snippet from Grampian police

Quote:
If you use barbed or razor wire, under the Occupiers
Liability Act 1984 you must take reasonable precautions
to prevent injury to other people, including trespassers,
caused by dangers on your property. If you are building a wall
on the boundary with your neighbour, you may need your
neighbour’s permission (under the Party Wall Act 1996).
If you live somewhere, such as an estate, where there
are building restrictions in force, you may need to get
special permission.
http://www.grampian.police.uk/Pdf/Ad...SafeSecure.pdf
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Old 02 December 2007, 17:47   #4
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as G.I.A.S said its against the law in case anyone hurts themselves on it for whatever reason,leaves you open to being sued
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Old 02 December 2007, 17:52   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by girl-in-a-scoob View Post
Law says No Im afraid.... all to do with people hurting themselves as they break into your property.

You could put anti-bandit paint on as once it is on you cant wash it off and the police can arrest you for questioning if they see people with it on.
Hi again!

Funny that, because I was at a friends house at the end of whose garden is the underground line. London underground have put up a fence with barbed wire between the line and the gardens. If they can do it why can't I?

I take it the same applies to anything else sharp/dangerous ie spikes etc?

Thanks for the heads up on the anti bandit paint


Thanks for the advice on the roof btw, I've decided to go with timber frame/double battened/felt/tiles/lead flashing
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Old 02 December 2007, 17:55   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exvaux View Post
as G.I.A.S said its against the law in case anyone hurts themselves on it for whatever reason,leaves you open to being sued
I suppose it could also hurt the firebrigade/police if they needed to gain entry, which is a fair point. Saying that though if there was a fire I would presume the fire brigade would just hack the wooden side door down in 10 seconds
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Old 02 December 2007, 18:01   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bugeyeandy View Post
A quick google search brings up this snippet from Grampian police



http://www.grampian.police.uk/Pdf/Ad...SafeSecure.pdf
Thanks. That doesn't say its illegal. How am I meant to take reasonable precautions to prevent someone being injured if I'm using barbed wire, when the whole point of the barbed wire is to injure anyone who tries to come over?
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Old 02 December 2007, 18:02   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deep Singh View Post

........ I've decided to go with timber frame/double battened/felt/tiles/lead flashing
Have you seen the price of lead recently? That won't be there for long dl


(they've even done the lead off the roof of a school around here.....)
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Old 02 December 2007, 18:15   #9
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I though there was a distinction made between commercial and residential properties.
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Old 02 December 2007, 18:23   #10
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Quote:
How am I meant to take reasonable precautions to prevent someone being injured if I'm using barbed wire,
It means make sure it's visible - ie you haven't dug a three foot trench and filled it with razor wire for someone to fall into.
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Old 02 December 2007, 18:28   #11
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Interestingly, our house is surrounded on 2 sides by a farmer's field where he routinely keeps cattle. The top 2 strands of the fence are "protected" by 240v electric

There's a couple of little yellow signs warning of the electric fence dotted about but it would appear that it's totally legal to do.

I've only clobbered myself a couple of times
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Old 02 December 2007, 18:56   #12
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Deep, the trick is to use natural barbed wire. Holly trees or pyracanthus plants, or even brambles if you can get them to trail along the top. The best bit is they look "decorative". Barbed wire to me suggests someone has something worth protecting / nicking (and is easy to get over just by throwing an old coat over it) - holly just looks like they want a hedge. Spiky plants are recommended by the police, I asked them about it for my house 8 yrs ago.

Over here we use bourgainvillia - wooden thorns an inch long

Brendan
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Old 02 December 2007, 20:01   #13
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so how come m.o.d establishments & prisons can use razor wire?

Mart
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Old 02 December 2007, 20:13   #14
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it is not illegal to use deterrants, but it must be a detterant and not a deliberate means to injure, hidden or inconspicuos barbed wire is a deliberate attempt to cause injury as are the, imo, nutters who embed shards of glass in the tops of walls.
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Old 02 December 2007, 21:00   #15
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The landlord of my warehouse has a electric fence all the way round his garden of about 2 acres, half of which fronts on to a main road. Its been there for about 10 years so far?? It has yellow signs dotted along every 20 metres.
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Old 02 December 2007, 22:05   #16
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house up the road has electric wire across top of his wall, his back garden at the side is next to pavement wall is about 8 feet
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Old 02 December 2007, 22:08   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mart360 View Post
so how come m.o.d establishments & prisons can use razor wire?

Mart
We've over the last few years taken down the barb and razor wire. Just in case anyone hurts themselves breaking on to base.
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Old 02 December 2007, 22:09   #18
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Reminds me of my student days in Middlesbrough; glass cemented into the top of a wall - some house owners used to use it as a form of decoration - also kept the cats out!


Nik
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Old 03 December 2007, 10:59   #19
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It really is quite disgraceful that if we do take such steps to secure our own property against burglars that they can sue you if they get a cut etc while breaking into the property.

What on earth has happened to this country when the criminals get priority over us when they are breaking the law!

Les

Last edited by Leslie; 04 December 2007 at 11:57.
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Old 03 December 2007, 11:08   #20
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You can do it, all this 'it's illegal' is *****....

As stated its covered under the OLA 1984, which places a duty of care on landlords/owners to protect 'trespassers' from harm. But ONLY harm that isn't obvious (such as a hidden danger).

You should place warning signs near the barbed wire that CLEARLY state that barbed wire has been installed, and also the signs must clearly describe this danger so that even a 'child' could also understand the danger posed.

You must be careful that there are no allurements, and that the fence, wall and barbed wire are maintained at all times. This is important as if you're aware of gaps in the wire and people crawling through these gaps you would be liable under the act for any harm caused to them.

There are several case laws surrounding this (trespass) and as long as you stop short of laying landmines you'll be fine
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Old 03 December 2007, 11:11   #21
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Still a ridiculous situation.

Les
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Old 03 December 2007, 11:19   #22
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Quote:
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Still a ridiculous situation.

Les
Agreed 100% Les...
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Old 03 December 2007, 11:29   #23
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Thanks to all. Barbed wire it is then. It will be clearly visible and at its lowest point will be approx 8 foot off the ground so there is no possibilty of anyone being caught up in it 'accidentally' ie children playing etc

Brendans idea is good though and I'll investigate that further
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Old 03 December 2007, 12:33   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCI Gene Hunt View Post
You can do it, all this 'it's illegal' is *****....

As stated its covered under the OLA 1984, which places a duty of care on landlords/owners to protect 'trespassers' from harm. But ONLY harm that isn't obvious (such as a hidden danger).

You should place warning signs near the barbed wire that CLEARLY state that barbed wire has been installed, and also the signs must clearly describe this danger so that even a 'child' could also understand the danger posed.

You must be careful that there are no allurements, and that the fence, wall and barbed wire are maintained at all times. This is important as if you're aware of gaps in the wire and people crawling through these gaps you would be liable under the act for any harm caused to them.

There are several case laws surrounding this (trespass) and as long as you stop short of laying landmines you'll be fine
That's exactly what I was about to type

It is very legal, all you need to do is put up signage... I looked into this quite seriously when I was renting a scumpit in a scumpit area about 8 years ago...
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Old 03 December 2007, 13:48   #25
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have you thought about carpet gripper rods, they can be treated the same colour as the fence
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Old 03 December 2007, 16:08   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j4ckos mate View Post
have you thought about carpet gripper rods, they can be treated the same colour as the fence
They would be more difficult to see and therefore be 'concealed', hence more chance of being sued
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Old 03 December 2007, 16:15   #27
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We put it up all the time Deep, residential, comercial and agricultural, make sure you put up warning signs.
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Old 03 December 2007, 17:00   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puff The Magic Wagon! View Post
Interestingly, our house is surrounded on 2 sides by a farmer's field where he routinely keeps cattle. The top 2 strands of the fence are "protected" by 240v electric


12V or less. I think there are a couple of 24V systems, but most run off a car battery or a rechargeable 9v battery. You can hold the wire for several seconds without too much pain - we used to play that game when I was about 7. I seriously advise you not to pee on one though...


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Old 03 December 2007, 17:31   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deep Singh View Post
Hi again!

Funny that, because I was at a friends house at the end of whose garden is the underground line. London underground have put up a fence with barbed wire between the line and the gardens. If they can do it why can't I?

I take it the same applies to anything else sharp/dangerous ie spikes etc?
They have liability insurance, you dont

AFAIK its not illegal to use it if you make it clear its there BUT you can be held liable for injury..
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Old 03 December 2007, 17:52   #30
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Quote:
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They have liability insurance, you dont

AFAIK its not illegal to use it if you make it clear its there BUT you can be held liable for injury..
Its not illegal full stop, the only difference is that if you fail to adequatley warn trespassers then you will be liable if they are harmed.. but only to the person, not property...
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Old 03 December 2007, 17:52
 
 
 
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