LEO-RS

I wish you hadn't have said that. I was at Crail on Sunday with one of my buddies in his supercharged Atom and funnily enough we went head to head...

http://www.crailraceway.co.uk/showcomp.php?RID=7&RUN=369&EVDate=2014-08-31

I won in this particular run, but if you look back to the results page I posted earlier, he got a best of 11.95 to my 12.00 so yeah he did beat me at the end of the day. That car is capable of more and will do low 11's but yeah I don't really see your point though, two completely different cars and the Atom would beat most cars given that it weighs 600kg and has 350hp.

The thread is getting out of hand now because old Mattee threw his toys out his pram over his M135i so in order to get back to A45 talk, will leave the little handbag fight with him there. Mattee, if you want to carry on with it in pm or meet me at a dragstrip to settle the score then please do so, always a firm believer in putting your money where your mouth is and backing things up

Matteeboy

We have another troll here.

One that can't fathom power to weights ratios.

Fastest laps; S3 5.1 to 60, M135i 4.8. 0-100 in 10.9 for the BM, over 12 for the S3 and that's BEFORE launch control was brought out in July 2013 (which mine has). A recent test showed 4.4 to 60 and 10.3 to 100.

Autocar M135i 0-60 in the slower manual; 4.6s.

I am happy to concede when a car is as fast or faster but your grasp of the basics is so bad, it makes a 2 year old look like an Oxford Don.

That's the last reply to the deluded troll who is GENUINELY stating an S3 is more or less as fast as an Atom; bwahahaaaa!

But if you HAVE to talk about tuning non stop;

LEO-RS

No, you're wrong mate. We were both at Crail yesterday, he ran a 12.17, I ran a 12.0. Same day, same conditions, same track. As fair as you can compare I'm sure you'll agree.

The 12.07 run is his own personal best and currently the A45 record to date.

Since then I believe he has fitted a standalone ecu and a hybrid turbo but yesterday he was running his rebellion ecu at stage 1. He posted slightly slower than he did March but that will be down to ambient temps. It was 20c yesterday, March time it would have been half of that. Was the same for all though, we were all running heatsoaked.

I'm sure both of us will progress in the next few months as temps come down and we start adding goodies

LEO-RS

Erm, you're really bordering on desperation now. No, I never said my car was faster than an Atom, I said I raced my buddy side by side and beat him on that run. I then went on to say he beat me overall. The car will run a 10.8 1/4m with a good driver.

You're embarrassing yourself.

As for fastest laps figures? The Audi S3 from Audi is quoted at 4.8 0-100km/h. The M135i as quoted by BMW is quoted at 4.9 0-100km/h. Perhaps try doing a bit of research before putting your foot in it.

As for fastest laps. Good grief. I have evidence of a standard car running 0-60 in 4.2, however, let's just stick to manufacturers claims. Either way. You're talking out your *** and have no idea. The M135i would only get to 62 in 4.9 with perfect conditions. (You tried launching a RWD car?) The 4wd Audi will do it considerably quicker than it's advertised, even in poor conditions.

You want to keep going with this Mattee and continue to ruin a thread? Upto you, I'm here all night.

As said tho, put your money where your mouth is. Meet me at a dragstrip

Evidence of what M135i's are doing at the dragstrip here..

http://www.crailraceway.co.uk/showdrag.php?RID=123&EVDate=2014-03-30

In other words, they're **** poor. The S3's/ Golf R's and A45's are in completely different leagues.

End of story really but argue black is white all you want. You're delusional and anyone that has ever been to a dragstrip knows the score. However, please provide me with evidence of an M135i matching the times of the cars I've listed. Please do.

Littleted

Tell Greg to loose some weight and get RENNtech hell have ya then.... You got lucky on that one by the looks of ya times, must have nailed it just right...

There's a 1000 dollar reward for first a45 under 12 so I hear

LEO-RS

Not at all mate. If you track back through the past events.

1st attempt was 12.01
2nd attempt was 12.06
3rd attempt 12.00

All very consistent there Also if you look at my times from that day, there were 2 x 12.03's in there too. So no luck at all

Audi S3 weighs 1415kg, A45 AMG 150kg heavier. Working out the PWR of both cars, not going to be much in it. Not all about the peak numbers mate but yeah I suspect he will go quicker soon especially if the 475hp rumours are true.

Haha, no pressure for an 11 then

Matteeboy

So you want to meet a total stranger to prove that your soulless but tuned up Audi is faster than a standard BMW?

My word, that would prove a lot wouldn't it.

Hey, we can then run that 1/4 mile where you'll find I'll be a lot faster because I'm a very good runner.

We could then cycle it.

Then we could race a top fuel dragster against a standard car too.

All would have as much point as you.

The point you can't seem to grasp is that a standard S3 is slower than an M135i. In every test (except your made up ones; notice how I quote my sources, you don't), everywhere, every time. Yes an S3 isn't MUCH slower but it is SLOWER. How can you not grasp that?

And while the M135i was universally praised, the S3 was once again called dull. As always with every recent Audi bar the R8.

LEO-RS

I buy performance cars to go quick in and take them to race events and vmax events to save myself losing my license. In other words, anyone that knows me, a true petrol head that drives his cars very hard.

Not quite sure what's chavvy about driving a performance car hard and racing it but each to their own. I would rather drive it hard like it was designed to be driven than pootle around in it posing. I had a brand new F10 M5 just beforehand, blew the engine within a 1000m, two TTRS's before that, still hold racing records with them to this day too. Launched over 250 times, heavily abused, we are talking £50k+ cars here, that's just me. I buy cars to drive hard.

Anyway, over and out. My post was friendly competition to the A45 guys seeing as we are talking about 2.0t engines. They've taken it in good spirit. The bmw assho*e obviously felt left out and threw his teddy out his pram.

Anyway over and out. Will meet up with Greg next time around

zip106

All these numbers - makes you all act like imbeciles..

Mean nothing in the real world.
There's some growing up to do on here me thinks.













The wife's F80 M3 is due in about 4 weeks and the numbers look intriguing
0-62 4.1 (has been timed at 3.8)
0-100 8.6 (!)
1/4 mile 12.1

That's for a totally standard car, the tuners are out in force now....

Matteeboy

But it's RWD so can't possibly be fast...

Oh and you're a bloody hypocrite.

zip106

But of course

john banks

Flat 12 is a fantastic time for chipped only 2.0T, even if the trans and AWD launch help. Well done!

Matteeboy

Disappointing.

LEO-RS

Cheers John, yeah it's surprised me a little too considering it's only at 360hp levels. Again, it's all in the 4wd, launch control and the DSG shifts, the same way the TTRS was. I think it will go mid 11's as soon as it has a proper tune and the exhaust and intake are sorted. 400hp power levels. Does 40mpg+ too on a run and can fit 3 young kids in the back. It was meant to be a stop gap til the new RS3, but also looking at M4 and CLA45 AMG too as my next car.

What are you hooning in about these days John?

Cheers Mattee 👍

john banks

D4 A8 and the GTR. Just fitted new AP discs and new pads all round which is about £1600 DIY even if some way short of £4000 at the dealer, still happy with just a tune and depreciation has been kind.

When you think what you used to have to do to get 11s at Crail it is very impressive to do it in a smooth and reliable car. A lot of litre bikes don't do much better considering a nice bit of East Neuk wind and a rough WW2 airfield surface.

LEO-RS

Yes, the early GTR's have turned out to be a bargain in reality, still commanding £35k from an initial £55k some 5yrs later. Pretty amazing to be fair.

4wd/launch and dual clutch shifts, cheating a bit these days I suppose but yeah as long as it has those three ingredients, the times are always going to be good especially if it's a low kerb weight car.

Only issues that are rearing their ugly heads and with all three German manufacturers are the warranty flag codes. Mercedes/ Audi and BMW tuners all having problems. Forcing us all down the piggyback tuning box path. Sign of the times I suppose.

Littleted

I looked at Crail last night that BMW1000RR seemed to have the best time, at 9.xx which is mad

Makes me want to pass my Bike test just so I can have 1
So leo why get rid of the S3, whats the driver.
The New M4 is nice but I couldn't stomach the 1000+ service cost but lovely car. The CLA is same internally as the A45 but with a diff rear and bonnet, why change do you see more potential in it, or is the S3 like I thought boring ? your not gelling with it ?

intrigued to know.


@Matt wheres good for 2nd hand campervans, wife wants a VW what am I looking for sub 25k please

Matteeboy

Ted; Bilbo always has a good stock; worth a look. £25k won't quite get you a California but it'll be enough for a decent converted van.
If you see any and want me to look, shout!

Those BM RR bikes are SO evil and SO nice!

LEO-RS

The S3 was only ever bought as a stop gap until the RS3 was released but after 3 months in, I'm having second thoughts about that too. I expected the upcoming RS3 to be released somewhere between Q4 2014 - Q1 2015 but current estimates are looking at Q2-Q3 2015. It's not so much that I'm bored with the S3, more so, that I think I've outgrown the fast hatchback routine. Fast hatchbacks have a ''boy racer'' stigma attached to them and sort of regret getting back into one. I have the choice of course of trading in and going down the S3 saloon path, or obviously waiting on the RS3 and hoping they release that car in saloon form too, or going a different way all together.

The M3/M4 tick a lot of boxes especially now that they have turbocharged engines, more easily tuned and much more economical than before. They are ideal fast family cars and the image, build quality, badge and tech are all up there with the best. However, a bugbear for me is rear wheel drive again, I'm just really not a fan and cannot seem to gel with it. When I had my M5, I admit, it was probably the worst car that I have owned, I just didn't gel with it, I couldn't or daren't take it to the drag strip as I knew it would post pretty poor times, coming off the back of low to mid 11 sec run from my previous TTRS, that would have pi**ed me off, it was very thirsty, felt heavy, handled like a boat and I never had the confidence driving it hard. Rear wheel drive performance is limited in the first 2 gears so you never really get that full thrust in the back feeling and you never really feel like its at 100% until 3rd gear and even then, in the damp/wet it can be very unpredictable struggling for traction. I guess this same logic applies to the M3/M4, although the figures are great, I reckon they would be a struggle to achieve in anything other than perfect conditions.

The Audi offerings are poor, actually very poor, S4/S5 are boring looking and do nothing for me, the RS4 and RS5 have the wrong engines in them and are very thirsty. RS6 too big and too expensive.

Hopping across to Mercedes, the CLA45 AMG ticks the saloon/coupe box, 4wd, dual clutch and launch control with a turbocharged engine, ticks all the boxes but again there's a small niggle there that it is only a 2.0t engine 4 pot and highly stressed from factory with turbo already running at 1.8 bar. C63 AMG is at end of life, no point going that path, again, rear wheel drive and it's a big thirsty brute but it will be interesting to see what they do with the new C class AMG.

Then there's the Porsche Cayman GTS, a car that goes against all that above, rear wheel drive, N/A engine, difficult and expensive to tune. 2 seats so no good for the kids and no doubt will be pricey to run but for some reason it's the car that is at the top of my list at the moment. Very very nice and the press seem to love it and prefer it over the 911 Carrera.

So yeah, all up in the air, nothing seems perfect for me at the moment, every car mentioned has a niggle at the back of my mind. Just trying to convince the other half to let me swap the S3 for the CLA45 at the moment, then in a years time, re-visit Audi with the new RS3/TTRS, I guess I'm addicted to smaller/lightweight/Turbo/4wd/LC/DSG cars that anything else seems like a massive compromise. M4 test drive this Sunday though so if the missus likes that (she hated the M5) then I may well go down that path.

Probably bored you to tears now but the answer is pretty much, I think I've grown out of boy racer hatches

Oh, and as for the bikes, 9sec 1/4's are insane, there was a big accident at Crail 2wks ago where a chap come off at 140mph at the finish line, he hit his brakes too hard and skidded with his bike into the tyre wall. He was airlifted to hospital and luckily survived. I don't trust myself on 2 wheels, the only reason I've never went down that road.

zip106

Leo - EVO did a drag test between the Macan Turbo and the M3.
The M walked it but they did say using launch control requires some feathering of the throttle to get the best out of it, whereas the Macan was just plant your foot and go.

Obviously down to the rwd / 4wd difference.

The Cayman GTS is a great car, but expect fairly robust depreciation.
Spec is also critical for resale IMO.

Littleted

Im with you on the RWD thing, I loved the M135 but after owning the E350 for 2 years I couldn't do RWD again it just wasn't for me, in the wet no traction getting stuck in fields when I took wife fel running, just wasn't practical for me personally.

Also being an It Consultant I spent many days at the airport or in Hotels, the amount of times the Scooby saved me when id come home or been snowed in was amazing.

im gonna stick to 4wd for the future and hope that MB or BMW eventually release a 4wd c63/M car to at least give me the option to move to a higher class.

I think MB did well in the price for the A45/CLA45 as its just a little too much to get the kevins and Waynes in, ok some will but most will draw the line at a 30K R S3 ( not saying your a kevin lol ) but it makes the Cut a finer class.... if you get my drift.

LEO-RS

I think the new Cayman is one of the nicest looking cars on the road at the minute (From the front and side anyway) the rear end is a little tame.

Been using the configurator and the GTS seems the better buy over a specced up Cayman S, at £55k base price, they aren't too bad, would be hoping for £35k at 3yr point as long as you don't go bonkers adding extras that would be acceptable depreciation, the GTS always commanding a premium over the base and S cars.

I'll get a better idea of the low end grip on the M4 on Sunday.

Littleted, yes, I agree with you completely reference the AMG vs S3/Golf R, makes it more attractive that its aimed at a slightly more shall I say it, 'wealthier' audience. It is Mercedes flagship afterall, I guess it really needs comparing to Audi RS and BMW M cars to be fair. Still cant help but think they should have used a 2.5l 5cylinder, a £50k screaming 4 pot is hard to justify but when I re-read my post, its the CLA45 that makes the most sense for me, ticks each of my boxes, that's the sensible head answer anyway

Littleted

I wonder of AMG wanted to have the worlds most Powerful 2L as a guide, easier to have that accolade , might have been all in the marketing and design of the thing...

Do merc do a 2.5 I think there all like 1.8 and 2.0.. unsure I know they do E250 but I think it isn't a 2.5...

LEO-RS

No, unfortunately not, I guess with the A45/CLA45 they had to make do with what they already had, a new engine base would have been a complete re-design but cant help but think it would have been better in the long run, 360ps is highly strained, where are the going to go with the next models in a few years time? Pointless fitting a bigger laggier turbo, 2.5-3.0t redesign would have given them a lot more scope for the future. Yes, they heavily market the car as the worlds most powerful production 2.0 so there was definitely a marketing strategy there. I guess they also wanted to keep economy in check with the 2.0 engine too.

Just watched the M3 vid, it obliterates it from 50+ and didn't look too bad off the line, posted excellent numbers

hodgy0_2

driving up the A1 today and saw a brand new BMW saloon, pretty sure it had M4 and X Drive labels on the bonnet

I am assuming X Drive is 4X4

LEO-RS

I suspect it would have been a 435d M Sport..

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/...14-CAR-review/

Impressive figures for our diesel lovers

Matteeboy

M4 is RWD only! The S55 engine is used is very similar to the N55 in mine.
Autocar just rated the M235i (coupe version of mine) above the the M4

Devildog

It is but they don't do an X drive M4.

Gotta laugh at these 1/4 mile times being given such importance. Impressive yes, but 4wd will always have an advantage up to a point.

Leo, you may have beaten your mate in his supercharged atom over the quarter, but he'd hand you your *** on a plate around, say Knockhill (assuming he could drive the thing). As would, I have no doubt, a standard M135i to a standard S3 given good drivers of equal ability.

Unless it was wet and greasy, of course, in which case the Audi would probably out run the BMW.

There's no question the BMW's engine is siblime - totally outclasses the VAG 4 pot turbos. Just as there's no question the DSG is excellent. But don't discount the sport auto in the BMW either.

And lets be honest, neither are lookers, although I'd say that the m135i looks more purposeful.

Just specced an S3 - £35k
same specced M135i - £35k

Nothing in it. Personally of the two I'd have the BMW because that engine is brilliant. Golf R wouldn't even figure on the list, no matter what the mags have to say. The Audi and the BMW are just nicer places to be 99% of the time.

hodgy0_2

yep - that looks like it (and my post should have said "boot" not bonnet)

Matteeboy

Good post DD.

Yep, any "M sport" BMW now has M badges all over it. Oh dear...

Having said that, the 435d is a belting car.

An M4 Grand Sport would be pretty awesome; sort of hatch boot but coupe shape.

You do have to ask whether an M4 is worth double that of the M235i though.