PORSCHE 944 TURBO
30 December 2008, 01:32 PM
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PORSCHE 944 TURBO
Whats the good and bad points about these cars, any experience of ownership here????
good or bad
whats the most frequent fault and whats the cost
whats the dearest thing to replace
good or bad
whats the most frequent fault and whats the cost
whats the dearest thing to replace
30 December 2008, 07:27 PM
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I owned one for 5 years.
I bought it in 2002 for 12500, it had 45k miles.
I sold it in 2007 for 7750 I think, it had done 80k miles by then.
In that time it had done over 500 laps of the Nurburgring, and a good few track days on R rated tyres and it averaged out about 2k per year running costs. I also had an AMD chip which increased bhp to 290 odd.
Best car I have owned.
Frequent faults:
Water Leaks
Oil Leaks
Cam cover gasket..£250
Head Gasket..£750
Brake callipers plates..£100
Remember even the newest car is getting on to be 20 years old.
I bought it in 2002 for 12500, it had 45k miles.
I sold it in 2007 for 7750 I think, it had done 80k miles by then.
In that time it had done over 500 laps of the Nurburgring, and a good few track days on R rated tyres and it averaged out about 2k per year running costs. I also had an AMD chip which increased bhp to 290 odd.
Best car I have owned.
Frequent faults:
Water Leaks
Oil Leaks
Cam cover gasket..£250
Head Gasket..£750
Brake callipers plates..£100
Remember even the newest car is getting on to be 20 years old.
30 December 2008, 08:00 PM
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Corrosion is a massive problem now, with the majority or cars either needing very expensive repairs, or having been done. Pull of the air vent in the base of the B-pillar and look into the sill void using a small torch...
30 December 2008, 09:10 PM
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its a 96 C-plate in white 169000miles
belts and waterpump just done
bottoms of the wings have some rust,some other light rust along sill to body line
floor looks solid,
doors open and shut like new!!
dash has cracked across middle (common)?
black leather interior, only problem , driver bolster worn through
(been told you can buy the piece for the seat???has a LSD
(rare??)has FUCH ultralight wheels
(££££)spare wing
spare rear shocks
spare standard wheels
no tax or test
what do you reckon on value
and davyboy, i've seen 1 or 2 lapping the nurburgring very quickly
another thing that is tempting , look like it might make a good track machine
Last edited by 51st state; 30 December 2008 at 09:12 PM.
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30 December 2008, 10:51 PM
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The LSD (M220) is quite rare, but itll be next to useless by now: they all need rebuilding.
Tatty and rusty (especially with the sills being rusty) itll be worth a damned sight less than the vendor will expect. 944 Turbos are usually greatly over-valued by vendors...
Tatty and rusty (especially with the sills being rusty) itll be worth a damned sight less than the vendor will expect. 944 Turbos are usually greatly over-valued by vendors...
31 December 2008, 12:08 AM
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I messed about and took too long to make my mind up when I was offered a similar aged 951 (from a well known specialist) for £1,200 last year. This had sports seats (red, admittedly, on a white car) and a full MOT. It seemed too nice to gut for a track car and I couldnt make my mind up: it was sold on eBay for about £1,500 in the mean time. That was a realistic price for a working car.
In my opinion it isnt worth anything like £3,000... As Ive said already: theyre massively over valued. I (reasonably) recently saw my old 1988 SE (incorrectly called a Silver Rose by the chuff selling it) advertised for not a deal off what I sold it for when it was well under ten years old, and its been to the moon since! There is no way that theyre worth the money that people are asking and I say that as someone who owned and ran most models in the nineties, from series one to 968CS.
In my opinion it isnt worth anything like £3,000... As Ive said already: theyre massively over valued. I (reasonably) recently saw my old 1988 SE (incorrectly called a Silver Rose by the chuff selling it) advertised for not a deal off what I sold it for when it was well under ten years old, and its been to the moon since! There is no way that theyre worth the money that people are asking and I say that as someone who owned and ran most models in the nineties, from series one to 968CS.
Last edited by GC8; 31 December 2008 at 12:10 AM.
31 December 2008, 11:16 AM
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I messed about and took too long to make my mind up when I was offered a similar aged 951 (from a well known specialist) for £1,200 last year. This had sports seats (red, admittedly, on a white car) and a full MOT. It seemed too nice to gut for a track car and I couldnt make my mind up: it was sold on eBay for about £1,500 in the mean time. That was a realistic price for a working car.
In my opinion it isnt worth anything like £3,000... As Ive said already: theyre massively over valued. I (reasonably) recently saw my old 1988 SE (incorrectly called a Silver Rose by the chuff selling it) advertised for not a deal off what I sold it for when it was well under ten years old, and its been to the moon since! There is no way that theyre worth the money that people are asking and I say that as someone who owned and ran most models in the nineties, from series one to 968CS.
In my opinion it isnt worth anything like £3,000... As Ive said already: theyre massively over valued. I (reasonably) recently saw my old 1988 SE (incorrectly called a Silver Rose by the chuff selling it) advertised for not a deal off what I sold it for when it was well under ten years old, and its been to the moon since! There is no way that theyre worth the money that people are asking and I say that as someone who owned and ran most models in the nineties, from series one to 968CS.
it has had no "spruce up" so all what you see is it, i dont think there is any hidden problems, pretty genuine car, parked at the end of a garden, green sap on it ,a few scabs , the way to buy one, i think
price is right
won't be giving that away theres 4 cars on ebay £3000 - 4500 and one locally has had 6 offers, what they i dont know, may ask the vendor,(bet it was £1500)
you can't beat these cheap cars, everything you get from them is a bonus
i have a 2.5 classic now and can't seem to get anything i want from it except bills
i'll be losing 3 times the cost of the 944 if i can sell it at a "reasonable" price
and all its done is sit on my drive for 12months
31 December 2008, 11:43 AM
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If the sports bolsters are spot on in black leather then youll get about £500 for the full set (including the vinyl rears). What the Fuchs wheels are worth depends on their part numbers. People will get excited if theyre 951 parts, although theyre nothing special, they do have a little extra backspace. If theyre a matched set then theyll be worth up to about £500 too, depending on condition, centres etc. Fuchs wheels were anodised which means that they cant be easily 'refurbished'; making condition more of an issue.
With regards to 'hidden problems', I disagree. You have described a car to me that I would expect to have bad corrosion hidden within the sills. If so they youre looking at the best part of £1,000 to have it repaired: an outrageous price I agree, but even sh*te Club Autosport over-sills bodged on costs £500!
Simon
With regards to 'hidden problems', I disagree. You have described a car to me that I would expect to have bad corrosion hidden within the sills. If so they youre looking at the best part of £1,000 to have it repaired: an outrageous price I agree, but even sh*te Club Autosport over-sills bodged on costs £500!
Simon
31 December 2008, 12:14 PM
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hi Howard+guys Yes Adam (500) is correct i do still have an early guards red 944t 1987 (omg 22 yrs old now
) and still going strong, i recently rebuilt my engine cos it was getting a tad tired 140,000m mine has uprated widefire steel headgasket, boost raised via chips and wastegate, lyndsey racing dual port wastegate,and boost controller, guru racing chips and was last dyno`d at 280bhp and 320 torques not bad from an originally 220bhp model.
i bought alot of performance parts from some of the following and hope these links help
1. Welcome to Lindsey Racing On Line. in states
2. Welcome to ProMAX Motorsport (top bloke but tad pricey)
3. New and Used Porsche Parts & Accessories (simon butterworth knows his stuff)
4. CHP - Quality Motoring Magazines web address for porscheand 911 world magasine.
5. Porsche Club Great Britain official Porsche owners club gb
6. Porsche Parts and Porsche Wheels - Jasmine PorschaLink UK good source of parts
7. OZ 951 Modification Notes forum advice on guru chips etc.
common faults are:
dash cracking due to sunlight
brembos tend to seize up if not used (but then so do most)
oil seals on balance shaft can leak not a big job just need to replace Tophats at same time.
overall good strong well made performance car and cheap to insure with classic car co. these days. Motorcycle Insurance (Motorbike & Bike Insurance) | Carole Nash.
bodywork should not really rot alot as they were originally galvanised with 10 yr warrenty but even galvanising aint perfect usually find it bubbles up around the stoneguard decals on the front wing trailing edge and rear leading edges, but nothing a good bodyshop can`t sort
find a good one and you will be well pleased as market has dropped these to silly money nowadys,
also checkout Clarcksons THRILLER dvd he does something intresting with a 944t
p.s almost forgot almost all the later 17"/18" wheels that fit the 911/boxster range will fit this car and update it loads, mille miglia do a good replica range for a huge saving over oem wheels and look identical.
) and still going strong, i recently rebuilt my engine cos it was getting a tad tired 140,000m mine has uprated widefire steel headgasket, boost raised via chips and wastegate, lyndsey racing dual port wastegate,and boost controller, guru racing chips and was last dyno`d at 280bhp and 320 torques not bad from an originally 220bhp model.i bought alot of performance parts from some of the following and hope these links help
1. Welcome to Lindsey Racing On Line. in states
2. Welcome to ProMAX Motorsport (top bloke but tad pricey)
3. New and Used Porsche Parts & Accessories (simon butterworth knows his stuff)
4. CHP - Quality Motoring Magazines web address for porscheand 911 world magasine.
5. Porsche Club Great Britain official Porsche owners club gb
6. Porsche Parts and Porsche Wheels - Jasmine PorschaLink UK good source of parts
7. OZ 951 Modification Notes forum advice on guru chips etc.
common faults are:
dash cracking due to sunlight
brembos tend to seize up if not used (but then so do most)
oil seals on balance shaft can leak not a big job just need to replace Tophats at same time.
overall good strong well made performance car and cheap to insure with classic car co. these days. Motorcycle Insurance (Motorbike & Bike Insurance) | Carole Nash.
bodywork should not really rot alot as they were originally galvanised with 10 yr warrenty but even galvanising aint perfect usually find it bubbles up around the stoneguard decals on the front wing trailing edge and rear leading edges, but nothing a good bodyshop can`t sort
find a good one and you will be well pleased as market has dropped these to silly money nowadys,
also checkout Clarcksons THRILLER dvd he does something intresting with a 944t
p.s almost forgot almost all the later 17"/18" wheels that fit the 911/boxster range will fit this car and update it loads, mille miglia do a good replica range for a huge saving over oem wheels and look identical.
Last edited by fwdnutz; 31 December 2008 at 12:39 PM. Reason: typo error
31 December 2008, 12:38 PM
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With regards to the above: Porsche state that 944s shouldnt run on anything greater than a 16" diameter wheel without fitting 968 camber plates and bushes. Youll need to replace the strut top mouts too, but even then they wont drive properly on 18" wheels.
31 December 2008, 12:47 PM
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i know what you are saying but never had a problem with my cars handling on 17" turbo cups, except for rear end grip but then when the boost comes in as aggresive as it does now (up from 0.6 bar to 1.2) it lights up the backend in most gears even in the dry which i am sure Howard will enjoy as he likes drifting the rear on most cars
plenty of suspension packages for these now and adj camber plates from lindsey if really that fussy about the handling but remember these cars are 50/50 weight balanced from the start due to rear mounted gearbox.
i do believe in the right hands these cars could embarass a few expensive perf cars including scoobys and their dreaded understeer
dyno results copied from promax website:
Vehicle Details Modifications Summary Power & Torque
Owner Car Modifications Exhaust Boost Controller Induction Boost Power Torque
Mark Koeberle T250 ProMAX Level 4 2.5 Fabspeed 4" EBC Controller Level 4 Intake 22 441.9 391
John Daly T250 Custom, DPW, MAP, 2.8 Standard Manual Boost Controller Custom Cone 18* 422 400*
Andy Abbey T250 ProMAX MAP1 Standard AccuBoost BMC F1 16* 334 330*
Paul Smith T250 GURU, DPW Standard Manual Boost Controller Standard 16* 315 337
Tony Foote T250 GURU, DPW, K27 ESS Reliaboost K&N Panel 16* 323 329
Gareth Husbands T250 ProMAX, DPW Standard Manual Boost Controller Cone Kit 16* 310 324
Chris Grahame T250 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Standard 18* 309 343
John Sims T220 ProMAX MAP1, DPW ESS Manual Boost Controller Cone Kit 16* 308 320*
Dave Malings T250 Boost Enhancer Standard Boost Enhancer Standard 15* 294 299
Terry Benge T250 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Cone Kit 15* 290 300*
Alan Halman T220 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Standard 15* 281.4 325
Phil Rowley T220 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Standard 16* 283 304
Tim Moore T220 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Standard 15* 275 310
Mark Dalton T250 Custom Mapping Standard Boost Enhancer Cone Kit 15* 270 296
Stephen Glasgow T250 Boost Enhancer Standard Boost Enhancer Standard 10* 255 278
Andrew Mais S2 ProMAX Chip ESS N/A Cone Kit N/A 250 219*
Rob Hunt T220 Standard BlueFlame Standard Standard 10* 219 241
To add your power results here, please send an e-mail to andrew@promaxmotorsport.com - Thank you.
plenty of suspension packages for these now and adj camber plates from lindsey if really that fussy about the handling but remember these cars are 50/50 weight balanced from the start due to rear mounted gearbox.
i do believe in the right hands these cars could embarass a few expensive perf cars including scoobys and their dreaded understeer
dyno results copied from promax website:
Vehicle Details Modifications Summary Power & Torque
Owner Car Modifications Exhaust Boost Controller Induction Boost Power Torque
Mark Koeberle T250 ProMAX Level 4 2.5 Fabspeed 4" EBC Controller Level 4 Intake 22 441.9 391
John Daly T250 Custom, DPW, MAP, 2.8 Standard Manual Boost Controller Custom Cone 18* 422 400*
Andy Abbey T250 ProMAX MAP1 Standard AccuBoost BMC F1 16* 334 330*
Paul Smith T250 GURU, DPW Standard Manual Boost Controller Standard 16* 315 337
Tony Foote T250 GURU, DPW, K27 ESS Reliaboost K&N Panel 16* 323 329
Gareth Husbands T250 ProMAX, DPW Standard Manual Boost Controller Cone Kit 16* 310 324
Chris Grahame T250 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Standard 18* 309 343
John Sims T220 ProMAX MAP1, DPW ESS Manual Boost Controller Cone Kit 16* 308 320*
Dave Malings T250 Boost Enhancer Standard Boost Enhancer Standard 15* 294 299
Terry Benge T250 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Cone Kit 15* 290 300*
Alan Halman T220 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Standard 15* 281.4 325 Phil Rowley T220 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Standard 16* 283 304
Tim Moore T220 ProMAX L1 Standard AccuBoost Standard 15* 275 310
Mark Dalton T250 Custom Mapping Standard Boost Enhancer Cone Kit 15* 270 296
Stephen Glasgow T250 Boost Enhancer Standard Boost Enhancer Standard 10* 255 278
Andrew Mais S2 ProMAX Chip ESS N/A Cone Kit N/A 250 219*
Rob Hunt T220 Standard BlueFlame Standard Standard 10* 219 241
To add your power results here, please send an e-mail to andrew@promaxmotorsport.com - Thank you.
Last edited by fwdnutz; 31 December 2008 at 12:54 PM. Reason: keboard gremlins
31 December 2008, 01:11 PM
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and finally check this link for a highly modded polished motor! to put even the ej20/25 to shame
924-944-951-968 at LINDSEY RACING - Your Porsche Performance Parts Center
924-944-951-968 at LINDSEY RACING - Your Porsche Performance Parts Center
31 December 2008, 01:40 PM
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Id avoid Lindsey Racing and Promax, personally. Buttercups alright, but he is even more expensive now than when he was selling stuff out of his garage...
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